Re: Superman vs Son Goku

by Chulance Tue May 19, 2009 11:07 am

Superman wins
Superman Wins

by Setsuna F. Seiei Tue May 19, 2009 11:46 am

Evolution Failku wrote:I fail at life
I fail at life

Superman vs Son Goku - Page 4 Comicdeathssuperman

Superman vs Son Goku - Page 4 Emotawesomepm9

by lol1991 Tue May 19, 2009 12:36 pm

Jae1022 wrote:
Evolution Failku wrote:I fail at life
I fail at life

Dude, get a grip.
That's grounds for a warning. Do it again and it's temporary ban.

by lol1991 Tue May 19, 2009 12:44 pm

PS:

Sorry for double post.

The part with the campangne is called JOKING and exaggeration. Comic book writers make jokes too. And the part with him flying in space...here's the fail. See, for one, I see nothing that says he's faster than light. Second, there is something called expression. Narrating a story is different form telling facts in the actual story. Seriously, start applying context to you evidence.

Finally...I couldn't see the last pictures.

by secor Tue May 19, 2009 2:00 pm

lol1991 wrote:
Dude, get a grip.
That's grounds for a warning. Do it again and it's temporary ban.

what r u talkin about?

by lol1991 Tue May 19, 2009 2:32 pm

secor wrote:
lol1991 wrote:
Dude, get a grip.
That's grounds for a warning. Do it again and it's temporary ban.
what r u talkin about?

He directly insulted a member of the forum. No matter how the member was acting, it's still against the rules.

by Chulance Tue May 19, 2009 7:00 pm

Yes getting mad at the fact I beileve Superman wins that's one thing but insulting me that's rude. Lol, give up that's not exageration my rules state if it's in the comics it's considered fact so yeah. You say wiki dosen't lie right checkl the wikapedia.

by VEGETA_DTX Wed May 20, 2009 6:00 am

Oh come on people is it really that you insult for serious or its just joke?

Come one its just a debate which btw can't be precisely judged...One may have this opinion other may have that opinion but that does not make us argue here when we all should be friends Smile

So PLEASE don't insult each other Sad

Just calm down its all cool! Wink

I personally think Goku even when SSJ1 is much stronger but oh if somebody don't think so I should insult him? no its all ok, he thinks so cause he have some other proofs and so on and so on...but none DBZ nor Superman are perfectly correct on the principles of physics, therefore we can never say for sure.

Relax people and have fun Smile

DBE FLOPPED! Very Happy

HHHEEEY DBE FLOOOPPED! Very Happy

LETS HAVE FUN NOT ARGUING Razz

by Chulance Wed May 20, 2009 10:31 am

Well DTX Debating is argueing to so who can win I just want them to explain how Goku can win and stop telling me what Superman can't do. If they don't believe me just go to wikia.

Now DTX let's debate you say Goku SSJ1 is stronger correct? Have you seen clear examples of Goku's strength? Sure he tossed a car but in the Babidi saga he hurt his knee slamming it against a rock during his fight with Yakon and he was slashed by his claws?

Goku isn't as durable is my conclusion he can slashed and he's been imapaled by the Special Beam cannon a drill like attack. He'smore durable against blunt force such as cannon balls and bullets but sharp objects can harm him. If were going by non-cannon SSJ4 Goku struggeled to lift a building but he can push people who are equal to him miles away into moutnains meaning he;s very strong and he struggled to lift 40 tons and as SSJ1 it was too easy.

If we go by GT his max is 100 tons barely but going by DBZ it's in the high 90's in SSJ3 he shaked the planet by pure energy he's not 100 tons around 70 to 80 Superman can lift 900,000 tons last time it was measured the doctor said the more he is exposed to the yellow sun the stronger he gets right? Therefore Superman is like Broly constantly getting stronger and the closer he's to the sun the faster he gets stronger. He also heals when exposed to sunlight so he can go into space and he's unstopable. He can beat Goku how can he stop that?

by Goku lamenting from the a Thu May 21, 2009 12:42 am

Dude, did you check what i posted a while ago?, it is all from wikipedia, there is proof there of exactly what superman current cannon superman can or can´t do.

and he is not nearly as powerful as you say he is, its all there it´s all from wikipedia

Ill posted it again
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superman%27s_powers_and_abilities

here it is

now for reference, this are goku´s powers and abilities

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Son_Goku_(Dragon_Ball)#Abilities

Ok, now, this fight is neve gonna happen, both are characters from very different universes, very different kind of comics, and even very different countries and cultures, and most of the time most are not even consistant with themselves, and what they can or can´t do is contradicted in many stories, more so in the case of superman that has been around for years and has been handled by many teams of writers, editors, artists etc, and has been adapted to several media, and is always somewhat different.

Goku is a bit more consistant as he was only written and drawn by it´s author and we see a gradual evolution of his powers and abilities that explain how he became as powerful, but then again if we put movies, and GT, and fillers, then it becomes more confusing.

And also if we consider that Toriyama didn´t really had a plan and made things along as he went, many times presured by his editor, and that he wanted to end dragonball after Friezza with the Super Sayan being the end all be all absolute powerful state, but then he had to expand on that and keep going and find new ways to make people more powerful.

There are bound to be several incosistences too.

And even if all the stars would allign and the impossible where to happen, and Toriyama would make a crossover with DC, probably to make both characters look good, they would probably be presented about equally powerful, and they would after some brief conflict become friends, so they wouldn´t really fight and we would be left with the same doubt.

But then we have Wizard magazine who did a hypotetical fight, Wizard magazine is the most respected or one of the most respected Comic magazine in the states, the people that work there certainly should know more about most characters than random fans in the internet, since it is their jobs.

And they don´t have an obligation to any company to make their characters look better over others, and if they did, then certainly they would side with superman since is an american comic magazine, not a manga or anime magazine, and is safe to assume their readership has more fans of superman than goku, and certainly they get more sponsorship from DC than sueisha or toei.

But their result is that Goku wins the fight, hands down

And if Superman could beat Apocalypse, and Flash (in a fight not a race), therefore Goku lets assume Goku could beat them too.

so every rational person in this forum, lets just accept this result and move on with our lives.

Altough certain individual probably will stay set in his own opinion, and nothing that is said or presented can change that.

Good for him

But really
Wizard Magazine vs Overzelous Fanboy on a forum

Who would you believe?

I stay with Wizard

by Chulance Thu May 21, 2009 1:14 am

Again this is a debate and Wizard dosen't count that was not debating tell me how Goku can beat Superman? You refused and therefore I win. There are MILLIONS who know Superman can beat Goku look it up on Yahoo answers says Superman.

I go with the fanboy. Give up and Flash is MORE powerful than Goku American comics are more powerful because they have more time to be written out. Flash is TRILLOIN times faster than Goku and can punch with Sueprman level strength or above. He can cause matter to implode and control speed.

THere was a revote and 80% said Superman would beat Goku, check your precious wikapedia. so wikia knows more than comics? I doubt it Superman can move faster than light and can lift ships and things. He can blow up planets and beat Doomsday. He can resist the effects of kryptonite and cosntantly goes stronger. He's immune to all Goku's attacks how does the saiyan wins he dosen't.

Winner=Superman

by secor Thu May 21, 2009 6:06 am

well... based on fact... i'd have to say goku could beat superman while he was in his virus coma, or when he was a kid, or a fetus, or semen, or in his fathers body, kicking ass as just a thought in his dads mind

by lol1991 Thu May 21, 2009 6:42 am

Modern era

John Byrne's post-Crisis on Infinite Earths revision of the Superman character in 1986 reduced the character's abilities. This was designed to make it easier for writers to come up with suitable challenges for the hero and to eliminate or reduce those powers that were believed[who?] to be "too sensational or unbelievable for modern audiences".[1] Emphasis was placed on yellow sun energy as a source for the character's powers. Superman's origin story was altered so that his powers developed gradually as his body absorbed yellow sunlight, and stories such as the Final Night series depicted the character gradually losing his powers when deprived of the sun's energy. Conversely, Superman can expose himself to increased solar radiation to temporarily increase his power.

Superman's strength was reduced to the point where he could still move tremendous amounts, but the character no longer had the ability to move planets. His speed was also reduced so that he could not come close to the speed of light. While still capable of surviving a nuclear explosion, such events would severely weaken him. Superman's sight, stamina and breath powers were also similarly reduced, and the character also required an oxygen mask for prolonged travel in space or underwater. His mental abilities were also curtailed to the point where intelligent humans, like geniuses Lex Luthor or Batman, could outsmart him. The powers of super-ventriloquism and super-hypnosis were not generally used during this period, although it was never stated whether they had been eliminated or not.

Superman's ability to fly under his own power was explained with the pseudo-scientific concept of "self telekinesis", an invisible telekinetic field that allows him to lift himself off the ground. Any objects that Superman touches are also enveloped by the field and this allows him to move them with the force of his will. In addition, the idea that of a supercharged bioelectric "aura" which acts as an invisible "force field" around and within his body was introduced to provide an explanation for his invulnerability.

Unlike previous versions, Superman's hair and beard grows normally, requiring the requisite grooming task using his heat vision, carefully reflected off a piece of the ship that brought him to Earth, to burn off unwanted growth.

After Byrne's departure from the series, Superman's powers and abilities were once again increased over time (though still far weaker than the silver age version). He regained the ability to travel interstellar distances and to hold his breath for the amount of time required to make such journeys, and move dwarf planets such as Pluto (when super-charged by immersing himself within a yellow sun). During the "Up, Up and Away!" storyline he regained his eidetic memory. He still retains his weakness to kryptonite, but instead of stripping him of his abilities, it causes extreme nausea, confusion, and pain. Superman cannot defend against any form of magic, so if he were to be hit with a magical fireball, the magical flame would burn him, but anything that caught fire wouldn't, as the flames would be non-magical in nature

Taken directly from wikipedia. I didn't even take out the references and links.

So, these are Superman's abilities. He can move small planets ONLY AFTER bating himself in the yellow sun. He can't blow them up. Nuclear explosions (which are about the equivalent of a strong ki blast.) will weaken him, and he his susceptible to magic. He also can't move at the speed of light

So all this into account, I say Goku wins. Goku's ki blast have long since surpassed the destructive power of a nuclear bomb. In the end, I would say there speeds are similar, but Superman has the advantage. In strength, if Superman doesn't fly into the yellow sun, it's also a bout a tie.
In endurance, well, I would say Superman wins. But Goku can overwhelm him if he catches him off guard.

Final verdict. In my view, Goku wins at SSJ3, maybe even SSJ2

by Goku lamenting from the a Fri May 22, 2009 1:02 am

Dude, really, there is the proof, straight from wikipedia, what else do you want, besides you constantly contradict yourself, you say wikipedia does not lie, but when it shows facts against what you say, you say wikipedia does not count, you say the DB movies are not cannon, yet GT is, you demand we use proof straight from the comics and when someone post a scan from the manga that proofs Cell can blow up a solar system, you say is bluffing, when half your scans are clearly figures of speach or even jokes or outdated and they don´t proof anything.

I bet if in that wizard fight superman was the winner, you would be waving the wizard around non stop.

Point is you are only gonna accept the things that support your theory and discard anything else.

So there is no point arguing with you

So, whatever.

by VEGETA_DTX Fri May 22, 2009 3:22 am

Anime Goku wrote:Well DTX Debating is argueing to so who can win I just want them to explain how Goku can win and stop telling me what Superman can't do. If they don't believe me just go to wikia.

Now DTX let's debate you say Goku SSJ1 is stronger correct? Have you seen clear examples of Goku's strength? Sure he tossed a car but in the Babidi saga he hurt his knee slamming it against a rock during his fight with Yakon and he was slashed by his claws?

Goku isn't as durable is my conclusion he can slashed and he's been imapaled by the Special Beam cannon a drill like attack. He'smore durable against blunt force such as cannon balls and bullets but sharp objects can harm him. If were going by non-cannon SSJ4 Goku struggeled to lift a building but he can push people who are equal to him miles away into moutnains meaning he;s very strong and he struggled to lift 40 tons and as SSJ1 it was too easy.

If we go by GT his max is 100 tons barely but going by DBZ it's in the high 90's in SSJ3 he shaked the planet by pure energy he's not 100 tons around 70 to 80 Superman can lift 900,000 tons last time it was measured the doctor said the more he is exposed to the yellow sun the stronger he gets right? Therefore Superman is like Broly constantly getting stronger and the closer he's to the sun the faster he gets stronger. He also heals when exposed to sunlight so he can go into space and he's unstopable. He can beat Goku how can he stop that?

Sure its hard to compare arguments cause like I just said many of them are metaphorical or not 100% seriously taken. ESPECIALLY cause there are so many versions of Superman and not all of them are considered by the fans nor even by creators of Superman.

But here's the another simple example - Goku SSJ1 could stop AND push back the Death Bomb from Freeza which could destroy whole Namek, (any one of Freeza's Death Bombs could destroy Namek, less/more, later/right away but it could) and we know that Namek is a big planet.
next Goku SSJ1 beats Brolly (sure with the help of other Z fighters by giving him their energies but still) and Brolly destroyed few galaxies one by another in a matter of seconds just cause he wanted it so.

You see now not only power-wise but there is another consistent thing about Goku....
Goku always wins...no matter how desperate situation is and no matter how much weaker he is he will always find a way Wink

He will get angry and rise his KI to another level or somehow take the energy from his fellows/people on earth or something but he will always find a way to win Smile

But yeah, even when compared only by shear power, GokuSSJ1 is again much more powerful IMO.
Look at just what young evil Vegeta was able to do(destroy planet with one concentrated laser from his fingers) and how FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR he is from Goku SSJ1...
And when it comes to SSJ2 and SSJ3 I think its obvious then.

so sure I like debates like this its all cool Wink

but none of us will probably change our opinion thats for sure and that the beauty of it Smile

by Ha! Fri May 22, 2009 3:43 am

Jae1022 wrote:
Evolution Failku wrote:I fail at life
I fail at life

by Goku lamenting from the a Fri May 22, 2009 4:58 am

Amen to that Vegeta DTX,

Im still sure Supes hasn´t faced anything compared to what Goku has, no matter if he can lift more, or how fast he is, a weightlifter or a runner could not beat a trianed fighter.

Goku was born to fight, he loves to fight, and he always finds ways to surpass his own limits and win at the end.

So Goku rules

End of story

by Chulance Fri May 22, 2009 4:49 pm

Lol, that proves I win this debate. Please don't just claim Goku wins I beg of you debate with knowlege. That post is old from years ago. Superman has owned some of the strongest wizards in existence and he can still fight with kryptonite near. He's gotten more resistent and flew through a red sun and retained his powers. So your proof is good read the comics. Kay? Superman can move LARGE planets with ease and blow up planets. Nuclear explosions cause no harm get over it and move on.

He can move faster than light and can resist magic. Goku looses he's not that strong he's a weakling in the DBZ verse. I hate how people overexageriate Goku's power he's not that strong he got hurt by hitting a rock and can be cut or stabbed. It's old! Your not being fair why not check the DC wikia which is current? Look at Goku on wikapedia it barely has any info go to the DBZ wikia and it gives you the truth! He is bluffing I said only things the characters have DONE not CLAIMED.

If Cell destroyed the Solar System go ahead than he wins. ALL my scans are facts and if you can't accept them than leave the debate get out. Finally DTX a serious debate okay Goku stopped and pushed back a planet busting attack? Freeza can planet bust at full power as seen in DBK episode 1 he blew up planet vegeta yet in planet namek he didn't have enough time to charge it to the level he did on planet vegeta and had to destroy namek by hitting the core it could damage namek at FULL power which it did not have.

With his robotic enhancements he could instantly create it full powered by SSJ Goku never pushed it back. Trunks did and since Goku is stronger than him we can assume he can. Anyway Superman has done similar feats and also Broly is a non cannon character so he dosen't count. If we bring him in he just continus to grow stronger but can be killed before he becomes stronger than his opponent. Again that's non cannon Vegeta destroying arlia all your feats have been non canon aside frmo Goku pushing back the death ball. I'll change my opinion if somone can bring in feats of Goku that outclass normal Superman.

Akira stated Goku could move at FTL only with instant transmission and Vegito was faster than light. He stated" You'll have to keep track of the light from my moments I'll be to fast to sense" or something he's the only cannon character to be FTL. Superman has trained in 1000 forms of fighting and Goku lamenting from an A debate or you will be ignored. I'll add the rule ignore Goku lamenting from an A I'm serious.

by lol1991 Fri May 22, 2009 7:00 pm

You don't make the rules here. You have the same powers I do. Don't push it AG. I'll leave you with a warning this time

I went to DC wikia. The Superman from Earth 1 is the one we use right?

Well, in his page, there is no distinction between what he did before and after the reboot, and in this debate, we only count the reboot version.

If you read Wikipedia closely, it clearly divides Superman's abilities by ages. So most of the stuff they put in the DC wikia is stuff from the silver age.

And stop saying we are not debating. We keep telling you our opinions. Plus, can you really measure how ki would affect Superman. The differences in universes make this almost impossible to judge.

by Chulance Fri May 22, 2009 7:24 pm

I mean the rules of the topic not the site.........

Earth one states he has infite powers. Were using New Earth superman. Yes we can how much damage has ki done. It's blown up planets but nothing stronger Superman has survived stronger without harm so we can conclude Superman can survive ki.

by lol1991 Fri May 22, 2009 8:22 pm

Yes I know you meant the topic. Again, just because you started the argument, means not you have more power over it.

I read up on the new earth one.

All the abilities that go beyond Goku's capabilities are a direct result of supercharging himself with yellow sun energy. It's the same as Wikipedia only with needless examples. If we assume they are fighting in a planet, and are not leaving that planet.

BTW, you do know a 40 megaton explosion is not that strong of a Nuke now a days don't you? Goku's ki blast easily match that. And don't try to argue on this. I'm the guy with guns in my sig. I know nukes. The stronget ever detonated was a 50 megaton nuke back in the USSR days. Now a days, it's speculated that nukes have about 80-90 megatons worth of power. All this to say that if he was knocked out by that, then Goku's ki attack can seriously hurt him.

As for his main weapon so to speak, his heat vision can reach powers equal to a nuclear detonation. Well, explosions in the DBZ universe have long since surpassed that, and Goku still makes it. The worst part is his ability to pinpoint. Goku can still avoid it, but if he gets hit.

Stamina wise, Superman clearly has an advantage, but don't forget, Goku is an alien as well. He's very resistante

Finally, let's analise his speed. He can only move at 1 % the speed of light when not in deep space, and we are assuming that the battle his on Earth. Goku's speed is not that different. I would even assume faster. Heck, I though Superman was much faster than that.

by Ha! Sat May 23, 2009 3:30 am

Ordinary saiyan equals superman... Goku is super saiyan... super saiyan >>>>>>>> superman xD

Goku know to fight better, he is faster and stronger.

Freeza's eye's attack is much stronger then Superman's...Freeza destroy planets with one finger etc... so Freeza>>>Superman

Goku>>>>>>>>>>>Freeza.

by VEGETA_DTX Sat May 23, 2009 3:58 am

@Goku lamenting from the a, glad you agree
But what caused the confusion between you and Anime Goku is that you did not stat any arguments and he stated that there has to be an argument and proof why you think so.
So yeah...

I've explained my arguments...and I think that way, I also agree with Sephiroth, but like I said even if power-wise Superman would be stronger, Goku is a born fighter he is living victory and he would always find a way to win.

Now, again about Cannon/Uncannon thing:
If we're not gonna count the uncannon stuff then Goku beats Superman in my opinion(I already gave my arguments for Goku) as in the original Superman comic book, Superman is supposed to be someone which best ability was to lift up a Car and fly with it, stop the train and airplane and such but having hard time doing it(am I wrong? please correct me since I really AM NOT much familiar with which is cannon and which is uncannon when it comes to Superman)

If we're gonna count everything official, both cannon stuff from the original storyline and uncannon than again Goku SSJ1 is stronger, considering Brolly example...etc...

Those were my personal arguments, its natural that everybody have their arguments and defend it from that point of view, I respect Anime Goku's opinion of course.

by Ha! Sat May 23, 2009 4:21 am

Raditz is stronger then superman... he with ease lift the car and blow to nothing... can Superman do that, can he? Razz

by Goku lamenting from the a Sat May 23, 2009 6:43 am

AG man, dude, dont ever, ever try to make a rule to block me ok, is not in your right, and this really piss me off.

And I have posted a lot of proff, dude i was the first one who posted the wikipedia article on superman powers, on how he differs from age to age, what is cannon and what is not, and the true story about the sword of superman.

I have posted a lot of facts, and you know im right and that is why you want to ban me, but is not in your power, so up yours man.

And just get off yout high horse dude, everyone here gives the victory to Goku we have analyzed all the facts, you are the only one who say superman wins.

So just accept your lost

And just so you know I was reading american comics, long before you even learned to read, maybe even before you where born, I knew all about superman or marvel characters, when you still tought Barney was the best thing ever.

Enough to say, I read silver age superman comics, when we still where in the silver age, so dont try to teach me about comics, because you will loose, and you will loose bad.

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